tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5883634615775822475.post1530394650495033351..comments2024-03-18T09:00:31.992-04:00Comments on Doctor Grumpy in the House: February 2, 1959Grumpy, M.D.http://www.blogger.com/profile/09858110332436246760noreply@blogger.comBlogger45125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5883634615775822475.post-50059409642442592852012-02-17T10:35:37.534-05:002012-02-17T10:35:37.534-05:00I'm a silly so-and -so, I forgot to add the li...I'm a silly so-and -so, I forgot to add the link for this cool chemical mystery.<br /><br />http://discovermagazine.com/1995/apr/analysisofatoxic493<br /><br />thanks for taking the time to read this.<br /><br />--longtime reader and medical studentLisahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00009553832429139814noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5883634615775822475.post-23107813653449473392012-02-17T10:32:13.701-05:002012-02-17T10:32:13.701-05:00Wow, just.....wow. Very interesting story. Here is...Wow, just.....wow. Very interesting story. Here is another mystery, still unsolved. A bit more recent, 1994. When I read it, I immediately thought of sharing it with you, Dr. Grumpy. Warning: lots of chemistry in this story. ---longtime reader and medical studentLisahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00009553832429139814noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5883634615775822475.post-13626298896811340202012-02-07T21:09:57.514-05:002012-02-07T21:09:57.514-05:00For people saying that it was military, then why w...For people saying that it was military, then why would the tent have been cut from the inside out if exiting from the front would have been easier/quicker. Why would they have stripped naked? Maybe military caused them to evacuate their campsite, causing them to get hypothermia. Most likely though, it was an avalanche.Vulcannoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5883634615775822475.post-6883057429956086492012-02-06T10:02:03.045-05:002012-02-06T10:02:03.045-05:00Yes I have to agree in a way with
Maurizio Morabi...<b> Yes I have to agree in a way with <br />Maurizio Morabito's comment they certainly may have simply stumbled into some military super-secret operation/patrol. however, at the same time the old Soviet union was nowhere near as bad for a law abiding citizen as we have all been led to believe.<br />I have met many Russians of that era who agreed on that, I come from that era myself.<br />I doubt we shall ever find out how or why it happened. </b>Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15724680180944364767noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5883634615775822475.post-36415831474836857542012-02-06T05:34:04.156-05:002012-02-06T05:34:04.156-05:00A more down to earth explanation...it was the USSR...A more down to earth explanation...it was the USSR in the late 50's, with U2s flying high and all the rest...the victims might have simply stumbled into some military super-secret operation/patrol. I'm sure those would have been scary enough to warrant running in one's underwear. And the four dead by the river might have been killed with a hand grenade, thereby explaining their injuries.<br /><br />Of course the aforementioned military would have had no problem in covering up the tracks and/or changing the records so as to make it appear as if no other tracks had been found.Maurizio Morabitohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10852130802624554276noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5883634615775822475.post-91859600098242974892012-02-05T22:17:26.040-05:002012-02-05T22:17:26.040-05:00-22F is cold...so maybe there was an avalanche and...-22F is cold...so maybe there was an avalanche and they could not get out of the regular tent opening...they decided to go make a fire- thus the tree branches, etc. but making a fire in a -22F storm...not so easy. And you would not make a fire too close to your tent because you would not want to burn it. And you might not have all your clothing on because you would want to warm yourself. In a storm/avalanche, you could easily lose your sense of direction, so the people in the frozen stream might have been trying to go back to the tent, but they got lost. Think about the windchill and the white out conditions at -22. 1959 -no gortex; no modern down clothing. Not a lot of room for errors.Chttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11823118794294237278noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5883634615775822475.post-72800293666003624072012-02-04T16:16:50.791-05:002012-02-04T16:16:50.791-05:00My idea of roughing it is a hotel room without air...My idea of roughing it is a hotel room without air conditioning in the summertime.<br /><br />This is a great story. Thanks for the post.<br /><br />About all investigators could be certain of is that:<br />all the people were very experienced<br />all were young and therefore felt themselves invulnerable<br />they carried a known amount of equipment and were not under equipped<br />they faced harsh conditions<br /><br />Likely an avalanche, perhaps several were involved. Hypothermia would also be a factor, but with their physical stamina and experience all of them getting hypothermia at once is possible, but not likely. There had to be other factors. The idea of a hallucinogenic of some sort is a good one, but it still doesn't explain everything.Mad Jackhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06190137186843630543noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5883634615775822475.post-50090589121513804962012-02-04T07:41:22.408-05:002012-02-04T07:41:22.408-05:00I found it an interesting story personally, the wo...<b> I found it an interesting story personally, the woodsman's comment on Hypothermia is quite true and would be worse at the altitude this party were camping I reckon.</b>Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15724680180944364767noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5883634615775822475.post-89344041641263337212012-02-03T07:40:02.909-05:002012-02-03T07:40:02.909-05:00OK - while hypothermia is plausible, how were the ...OK - while hypothermia is plausible, how were the higher than background radiation levels explained? Same goes with avalanche. Former testing location? Just coincidence or something of substance? These inconsistencies are likely why the mystery remains...Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5883634615775822475.post-48091989281782204882012-02-03T00:32:21.535-05:002012-02-03T00:32:21.535-05:001) my vote goes for hypothermia, it makes the most...1) my vote goes for hypothermia, it makes the most sense. Fortunately this didn't turn into a Donner party story.<br /><br />2) Dr. Grumpy, isn't your son a Boy Scout? Doesn't he do Winter Campout - snow caves? haven't they coerced you into going yet?<br />;-)<br /><br />3) When you speak Russian, any russian word that is spelled phonetically drives me batty. I can't figure what they are trying to say and have to find it in Cyrillic. LOL<br /><br />4) loved the article ... in a sick, morbid way. And it wasn't about some giant beaver/rat/nutria that was yanked out of hibernation.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5883634615775822475.post-38960102766687387562012-02-02T23:00:49.535-05:002012-02-02T23:00:49.535-05:00I've seen this story on several different webs...I've seen this story on several different websites. Some claim there was no "mystery". The group were in their tent and an avalanche occurred and each thing listed as "mysterious" is given a plausible explanation. But like you say only 9 people know truly what happened that night and none are alive to tell it.Dafeenahhttp://www.indiedesignz.com/blognoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5883634615775822475.post-38450685957487242422012-02-02T22:24:24.544-05:002012-02-02T22:24:24.544-05:00Dr. Grumpy- I live in Michigan. Detroit, specifica...Dr. Grumpy- I live in Michigan. Detroit, specifically, for med school right now (err... next year really when I'm done with medical leave). One of my friends, from Cuba, yes, CUBA, meaning he knows NOTHING of the cold, wants to go camping in the upper peninsula this month. In a cabin with no heat, electricity, or a toilet. In all honesty, I told him he had a pretty good shot at dying alone up there because no one in their right mind would go with him. I think I'm going to point him to this story and ask him to consider choosing life.<br /><br />To summarize, I love civilization. It got us so far. There's no need to pretend it doesn't exist.Allisonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01957870218750281678noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5883634615775822475.post-84205268435638929072012-02-02T20:51:21.943-05:002012-02-02T20:51:21.943-05:00I have just commented then realised that drugs wou...I have just commented then realised that drugs would not necessarily account for the trauma of the people found by the stream...and was the park closed for 3 years just because of this tragic and fatal event, or was there higher levels of radiation than normal? <br />Those poor families not ever knowing.<br />KateAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5883634615775822475.post-43061993943401658382012-02-02T20:42:34.717-05:002012-02-02T20:42:34.717-05:00I think I am most to agree with Syrlinus - a sud...I think I am most to agree with Syrlinus - a sudden and odd behavioural change in all of them to make them do things they would not normally do?? Could they have had some from of drug/been exposed to some sort of chemical that would ellicit such behaviour? Did they smoke something? Was water they used poisoned? Were there such tests then used during autopsy to eliminate drugs/chemicals in their bodies?<br />I guess I'm just stabbing in the dark for possible ideas much as anyone in these tragic sort of events.<br />A fascinating and sad story Dr.G. <br />KateAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5883634615775822475.post-60589671883956144352012-02-02T20:03:37.932-05:002012-02-02T20:03:37.932-05:00I LOVE stories like this . . . very subtle underto...I LOVE stories like this . . . very subtle undertones that get creepier the more you think about them.<br /><br />Of course there may be a perfectly reasonable explanation, but that wouldn't be any (morbid) fun. :)Liz 2http://facebook.com/sinaguanoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5883634615775822475.post-29851373880098609982012-02-02T19:58:03.772-05:002012-02-02T19:58:03.772-05:00Like anonymous @ 1:06 PM I also immediately wonder...Like anonymous @ 1:06 PM I also immediately wondered about the possibility of ergot poisoning. LSD was initially derived from ergot.<br /><br />WV: noongs<br />Maybe they were attacked by noongs.RSDSnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5883634615775822475.post-5108283431690278972012-02-02T19:37:44.860-05:002012-02-02T19:37:44.860-05:00Take a look at this: http://skeptoid.com/episodes/...Take a look at this: http://skeptoid.com/episodes/4108Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5883634615775822475.post-15736813014103933442012-02-02T19:31:45.419-05:002012-02-02T19:31:45.419-05:00My initial thought was drugs too. I don't know...My initial thought was drugs too. I don't know enough about individual drugs to know which could have led to this, but it seems like drugs would explain why they may have cut the tents open from the inside, and then hypothermia took over after that.<br /><br />SeaSideRobin, the Sasquatch is found (or not found, depending upon to whom you talk!) in Canada and the Yeti in Nepal around Mt. Everest. I'd never heard of Almas before! The things you learn from Dr. Grumpy!Vickinoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5883634615775822475.post-88453376304919350772012-02-02T18:45:23.623-05:002012-02-02T18:45:23.623-05:00The problem I have with the hypothermia and parado...The problem I have with the hypothermia and paradoxical undressing is that 9 people snuggled together in a tent ought to be able to keep quite warm.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5883634615775822475.post-71112780700672221492012-02-02T18:36:48.201-05:002012-02-02T18:36:48.201-05:00January 1988 my sister died of hypothermia exposur...January 1988 my sister died of hypothermia exposure climbing Marcus Baker, one of the higher peaks in the Chugach Range. She was an experienced climber, having climbed mountains and glaciers, skiied, ice-skated, bushwhacked in winter, etc. since high school. She was in a party of three. It was a January climb during winter break from UAA. She had prepared adequately. They had taken a map which was inadvertently the opposite route of their climb, and had to backtrack a day. They were within several hundred feet of summiting. My sister wanted to rest and made camp to await the other two who thought they could easily reach the top within hours, however a storm came up. Those at the top were stranded for > 24 hours. When they returned, my sister had died. Hypothermia, and lower levels of oxygen distort the senses. She was found frozen several feet from the tent, with only her lighter garments, scratches to her face apparently from being tossed by the wind during the storm. At the wake, my brother spoke to the issues of climbers staying together, and she might have lived to scale another peak if that had been the case. She'd already attempted Denali, and was interested in UW Climbers on Everest that summer. Low oxygenation affects humans to different degrees. Anchorage is sea level. Mountain ranges in AK are among the highest in the world considering base at sea level.<br /><br />An interesting story of the Ural Mtn climbers.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5883634615775822475.post-34703598513477833212012-02-02T18:27:06.512-05:002012-02-02T18:27:06.512-05:00I always enjoy your history posts! Thanks!I always enjoy your history posts! Thanks!Tarynhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16523449106100926340noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5883634615775822475.post-57070960956027454462012-02-02T17:20:16.366-05:002012-02-02T17:20:16.366-05:00Well if Almas (the yeti type creature) was really ...Well if Almas (the yeti type creature) was really a radioactive man gone wrong ..... Wait... I know what happened! Combining several comic book answers, one of the campers turned into the Almas due to weapons testing in the area. The campers had to cut out of the tent to escape the hulk style rage, some tried to climb trees (and were killed there). It declared the tent area its own territory. Two decided to return and fight the beast while the others stayed at the creek. But before they could take the Almas out, the radioactivity that had been contained in the beast exploded, killing all on site. Solved it!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5883634615775822475.post-21138157936096591952012-02-02T14:06:56.804-05:002012-02-02T14:06:56.804-05:00What about ergot poisoning from rye or other grain...What about ergot poisoning from rye or other grains? Then things could have gotten trippy with everyone having hallucinations. Can't find what the typical time of onset after ingestion is, however, and whether they'd all peak at the same time.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5883634615775822475.post-27956795554356200202012-02-02T13:18:09.804-05:002012-02-02T13:18:09.804-05:00I am an experienced outdoorsman. thus my name. Hyp...I am an experienced outdoorsman. thus my name. Hypothermia causes confusion and one of the things that may hypothermics do is strip naked. Mystery solved. Hypothermia can kill you at 60 degrees, it doesn't have to be super cold.Packerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10790343423937405624noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5883634615775822475.post-28812842805199427812012-02-02T12:40:21.155-05:002012-02-02T12:40:21.155-05:00Thank you for another great tale.
My idea of camp...Thank you for another great tale.<br /><br />My idea of camping is slow room service.Margarethttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12984912401273140073noreply@blogger.com